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Re: [TenTec] Yamaha CM500 headset and Orion II

To: <k9yc@arrl.net>, "Discussion of Ten-Tec Equipment" <tentec@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [TenTec] Yamaha CM500 headset and Orion II
From: "Bob McGraw - K4TAX" <RMcGraw@Blomand.net>
Reply-to: Discussion of Ten-Tec Equipment <tentec@contesting.com>
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2013 11:25:02 -0600
List-post: <tentec@contesting.com">mailto:tentec@contesting.com>
In most cases, the MIC Gain is usually located electrically after one to two analog stages of amplification. Should the first or second analog stage be driven into clipping or distortion, adjustment of the MIC Gain, being after the first stage, will have no effect on any clipping or distortion occurring in the first stage.

Typical mike input circuits are designed for low noise and high gain with acceptable input signal levels between -70 dBv and -30 dBv. If the mike of choice is one that has a high output level, and used with a radio lacking an input gain control, the first or second stage can be overdriven. For a radio lacking an input level control, not to be confused with the MIC Gain control, but that is one which is pre the first stage, then some value of attenuation must be employed to prevent overdrive of the first stage.

We may be talking semantics with regard to terminology. The mike preamp gain is clearly a separate control from the front panel MIC Gain function. In the Omni VII, the hardware gain or preamp gain is under the bottom, left front of the radio. The Eagle and the Argonaut VI hardware gain controls are on the side and accessed through a small hole. In general, most Tentec radios come from the factory with the hardware gain set for maximum gain. This is to accommodate lower output level mikes such as the 707. For higher output mikes, in many to most cases, adjustment to reduce the hardware gain is required of the user. This depends largely on the type mike and the mike technique employed by the user.

As a general guideline, I suggest a MIC Gain value to be operated in the 35% to 50% range. If yours is operating 30% or lower, I urge you to reduce the hardware mike gain such as to allow normal ALC LED actions with a higher value of DSP or MIC Gain value.

73
Bob, K4TAX






----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Brown" <k9yc@audiosystemsgroup.com>
To: "Discussion of Ten-Tec Equipment" <tentec@contesting.com>
Sent: Monday, December 16, 2013 11:49 AM
Subject: Re: [TenTec] Yamaha CM500 headset and Orion II


On 12/16/2013 5:46 AM, Richards wrote:
I chance to disagree with just this one minor point ... and offer my Omni VII and Orion II as an example. On the Omni VII one has to turn the AF-GAIN down to nearly 1 or maybe 2 before it does not cause the ALC light to come on all the time. Similarly on a pair of Orion IIs - one mine and another in a contest shack - although it was not as drastic on that rig as it is on the Omni VII.

Something does not compute. The function of the AF-GAIN pot is to adjust the mic output level to the rig. The numerical setting (dial setting) does not matter. What matters is the audio drive level that AF-GAIN produces at the output of the audio stage.


Still, I venture to recommend a voltage divider or simple L or T pad to reduce the inherently high output which cuts it down to approximately what the rig sees from a typical dynamic mic cartridge. This gives the ALC more headroom to do its magic. I believe crowding it down to very low AF-GAIN kinda crowds the ALC so that it can be difficult to set -i.e., it is either all on or all off, and on my Omni VII, the mice is either on or off by the 2% setting and ALC is on all the time at that setting.

Nope. ALC action occurs AFTER the audio gain stage that is being adjusted by the AF-GAIN control . The only indication that an attenuator (pad) was needed would be audible distortion on the transmitted signal, which would be the result of the audio stage being overloaded by the mic (and clipping at the input). That is VERY unlikely unless the Ten Tec engineers are a LOT dumber than I think they are.


Thus, it is my opinion, an attenuator pad is a good idea, and makes the mic appear to the rig more like a dynamic mic (which I believe it is designed to expect most often.)

Lessee -- I'm an EE by training and profession, and you're a retired attorney. Last I heard, you hadn't done extensive study of electronics to catch up. I wouldn't consider give legal advice -- heck, even though I know a helluva lot about acoustics, I'm not trained in that field and know my limitations, so I don't give advice on acoustics either.

73, Jim K9YC
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